Comments on: Derrick Favors Season Review http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/ The ESPN TrueHoop Utah Jazz Site Thu, 18 Sep 2014 23:19:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=4.0 By: Scouting Reports vs. Reality: The Jazz Core Revisited | Salt City Hoops http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94226 Thu, 05 Jun 2014 23:05:20 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94226 […] a full report card on Favors’ fourth NBA season, check out Ben Dowsett’s recent piece on the former #3 pick. For these purposes, suffice it to say that Favors, in broad strokes, is on […]

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By: Dustin http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94195 Wed, 04 Jun 2014 23:19:21 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94195 Would Ante Tomic be an okay 5 with Favors? He’s has a jumper and is a good passer and is almost as tall as Gobert.

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By: Mewko http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94177 Wed, 04 Jun 2014 04:17:19 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94177 I think Derrick Favors can be like Kevin Garnett, minus the mid range jumper.
“In your face” personality, good paint protector, good rebounder, defensive anchor, good passing out of post, good post up moves. That would make Favors worth his new contract, and worth trading for Deron Williams.

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By: Ben Dowsett http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94093 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 21:28:59 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94093 Yeah, you may end up being completely right there. He absolutely has the physical tools that if surrounded with the proper teammates he could be a menace. I agree, he’s not quite at that “deterrent” level just yet – I think he still needs to master the whole “verticality” thing (hate that term but it’s still a meaningful thing), he’s currently far more dangerous as a leaper along with the opposing shooter, which still opens him up to fouling too often against savvy finishers.

And yeah, pair him with a real defensive center and the help-side D is just going to be insane. Teams are going to spend his entire career underestimating his leaping and length, it’s so deceptive. My biggest concern by far remains in the post, where he’s been brutalized over the last two seasons. Again, a lot of this relates to playing out of position a bunch (IMO), so it’ll be telling to see how he develops there.

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By: Dan Clayton http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94082 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 21:17:50 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94082 Yeah that’s precisely my point: SportVu gives us a jumping off point, but to analyze completely requires more than just dots on a graph. From having watched every second of Favors’ season, I would say he’s not a guy that is generally a deterrent – meaning I haven’t seen a lot of opponents change their mind when they saw him and dribble away. What I have seen a LOT of is Fav trying to cover up for Marv’s lack of size or Enes’ occasional lack of discipline, and then he winds up coming into the picture late — in time to have that type of play counted in his denominator for “opponent attempts at the rim” but too late to actually impact that. I think if you surrounded Favors with guys who consistently did their job defensively, we’d suddenly realize how good he’s been. I started to notice at the end of the 2012-13 season how Fav hardly ever does anything wrong within the team defensive structure, and was often showing other guys (even vets & guys at other positions) where they were supposed to be.

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By: Ben Dowsett http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-94064 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 21:01:02 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-94064 Thanks for the kind words, Dan. Also, you’re completely right, and I was remiss to not include a caveat about this – I actually seem to remember writing such a sentence, but may have accidentally removed it during editing or something. That sort of give-and-take is definitely relevant when assessing a player as an overall rim protector.

One interesting bit that’s something of a mix of both worlds is how some of the top rim protectors by public perception (Hibbert, Ibaka, etc) still rank at or near the top in terms of FGA Against at the Rim Per Game. Like I say, this speaks to both sides of your point – some of this is likely because those guys are confident and super willing to challenge anything and everything in their vicinity, knowing they’ll win the battle a lot of the time. But at the same time, it makes determining which guys are truly the biggest deterrents – as you say, the guys who scare opponents away before they even get a shot off – difficult to quantify (though I hope in the future, more advanced iterations of SportVU data might be able to at least help here). These are the bits of context we certainly have to take into account, and my apologies for not including such a caveat within my piece.

Also, thanks to everyone for their comments. I may not respond to everyone individually (plus you all don’t need to hear my opinions on EVERY little thing), but I can tell you for sure that all of us at SCH have really been enjoying the frequency of comments in recent months. Keep it up!

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By: Greg http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-93969 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 19:10:06 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-93969 I don’t think Trey has huge upside. He is undersized and does not have the quickness to overcome that like Stock did. There are character issues with Smart, but if Exum, Embiid and Wiggins are gone I think he would be good choice because of the toughness, defense and bball leadership he brings. All traits that are sorely lacking on this team.

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By: Dan Clayton http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-93775 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 15:56:20 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-93775 Great piece as always, and you do a great job of explaining why it’s hard to accurately assess Fav’s defense at this stage. I’ll chime in to further muddy the waters. I think there are some real risks to using SportVu’s rim protection stuff as an indicator. The way it measures, it can actually penalize guys for trying to help when their teammates mess up (which, let’s be honest, Fav’s teammates did a lot). A matador defender like Boozer who never comes over is not going to have those plays where he gave up factored into his SportVu rim defense numbers, whereas Fav making a last-ditch effort when other guys have missed a rotation might be the right thing to do, but cost him points in the way the SportVu math works out. Similarly, guys who are real deterrents – they are so imposing that penetrators seem to pull back when they see the big guy waiting – are actually the most effective rim protectors of all, but those types of plays won’t show up in their stats.

Not saying Fav doesn’t have issues as a rim protector, but I think SportVu oversimplifies the calculus considerably in a way that doesn’t give Favors credit for his ahead-of-his-age understanding and execution within the defensive system.

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By: zach http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-93708 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 14:51:20 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-93708 I think Gobert needs more time in there, and I like the idea of trying to get Asik if he can be obtained cheap. Both pair with Favors well in my opinion. I think Utah should trade #5+35 to Orlando, for #4 and get Exum (assuming Wigggins/Parker/Embiid are gone). Then move Kanter to LA for #7, and get Aaron Gordon, this may be too much for Kanter, but he isnt fitting in in Utah and LA would take it as Kanter would replace the departing Pau. This gets a long athletic group and a much better bench. If Hayward leaves, Even Turner may be an option, he likely wont be as expensive. Favors needs to be the leader of the team rather than Hayward.

Asik/Gobert
Favors/Evans
Gordon/Marv Williams
Hayward/Burks
Exum/Burke

I would love to see the Jazz do another Golden State deal…take back old veterans for good later draft picks…as long as they dont play them too much, or at all (aka Richard Jefferson).

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By: Paul Johnson http://saltcityhoops.com/derrick-favors-season-review/#comment-93589 Tue, 03 Jun 2014 12:48:16 +0000 http://saltcityhoops.com/?p=11744#comment-93589 Sorry, I meant Burke not so much.

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